In the next version of Access, the much cursed, the difficult to understand but quite detailed security system that is known as User Level Security (workgroup security) is not going to be supported by the next version of the Microsoft Jet engine. The way that it is going to be phased out is as follows.
Access will support Access 2000-2003 databases (mdb, mde, and mda) in a similar manner to what you are used to.
If you or your users upgrades your databases to a new file format called a ACEDB format, workgroup security will not be supported. This means in reality that you will then need to rely on personal protection systems for your security. If you are a reader of my book on Access protection and security, this means that you will only be able to draw on Chapters 1-6 and Chapter 12 for information if your database gets upgraded to the ACEDB format.
The good news though is that you have removed ownership from the Admin account for any object in the database, your users will need Administrator workgroup accounts and passwords to upgrade the database to the ACEDB format and you will be left with managing the MDB in much the same manner. In this situation Chapters 7, 8, 10 do apply and arguably are more important. Of course when Access 2009/2010 rocks along, this may change and you may be forced to upgrade. Of course the new features in Access at this time may also encourage you to upgrade.
To counteract the developer protests on removing workgroup security, Microsoft have beefed up the database password so that it is not stored in the database and invented a way that macro security warnings can be turned off if a database is stored in nominated folder.
Please sign up for Beta 2 if you feel that this depreciated feature is going to affect your database going forward. Remember if you do so, please use a spare computer or an empty boot operating system for your testing. As I am a Beta 1 participant, I cannot make my views on this depreciated feature topic known.
To view the chapters in my book, head to read the table of contents in PDF format or head to a page describing the book at vb123.com.
What are your thoughts on User Level Security getting squished...
Tuesday, February 21, 2006
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221 comments:
1 – 200 of 221 Newer› Newest»Losing Workgroup security is going to be a pain, but I suspect that most novices won't notice because they weren't using it anyway.
I suspect most advanced developers will either roll up their sleeves and write a security class that takes care of all this or will buy/borrow/plaigarize someone else's.
I think the biggest issue (and I'm not a beta user) is going to be whether or not MS fixes the name tracking feature, among other things, in the next version.
I have been making my living with Access for the last 5 years, and your earlier comments on forcing novices to do it right are dead on.
Coming in after someone who has just clicked a form together with macros behind is a real pain in the posterior. Eliminating macros altogether would be a good first step.
Okay, that's my rant.
As for Macro security going away, no chance, Office 2007 has beefed up macro development.
The access trap article you mentioned is here
http://www.vb123.com/toolshed/05_docs/accessdevelopertraps.htm
I love Access but currently feel a little gloomy about the future. Access is being dumbed-down. Microsoft said Access 12 would be much easier for novice users - then don't make it part of Vanilla Office. Most users will therefore use Excel rather than trying Access anyway. Mdbs seem to be an endangered species. ACE will not support user-level security or replication. These were powerful features. Why didn't Microsoft beef up User Level security and replication rather than ditch it (unless it's to force us to use SQL Server as a backend). Access is brilliant for the SME environments I develop application for. I find .NET unfriendly and backward, much less 4GL than VBA, and I don't want to use SQL Server as a backend for most applications. For one thing, some clients will not allow SQL Server on their networks. For another, the extra development time will push my costs up. The much-hyped extra functionality with SharePoint is surplus for most of my clients too. I didn't really agree with the bloggers saying there have been no major advances in Access since 97 but now I'm seeing what they mean...
I find it difficult to comment on this loss of workgroup security apart from saying that I am very concerned. There is very little information on what is happening. We know we are losing it, but all we have heard is that there is a beefed up database password. There is new navigation stuff being built in, but does this mean no-one can get at, say, the Connect property of a linked table? Assuming, perhaps wrongly, that this version of the database password mechanism won't be cracked (unlike previous versions), it gives just the one level of access to the database. In previous versions, developers used user-level security because the one level afforded by a database password was insufficient.
Two questions for Microsoft (asked elsewhere but no reply received):
1) Why are you removing an important feature that has been in the product since the start? I thought MS were hot on security now.
2) If I have misunderstood what is happening, why, oh why won't anyone at MS tell us how to bring at least a modicum of security to the way we work at least 90% of the time, i.e. with an MDB/ACEDB back end (I'm assuming SQL Server and Sharepoint back ends manage to reach something like 10% of the total)?
The other stuff in this next version of Access looks really good to me, but this security thing has got me really worried. If it is not done properly, the new Access becomes just a whizzy toy (unless your customer can pay the extra for a SQL Server or Sharepoint back end. Many will not.)
I don't know about others, but User Level Security never worked right for me. It was more trouble than it was worth and wasted alot of time. Glad to hear we are getting a chance to try something different and hopefully, better. In fact, anything else has to be better.
With the loss of User security and replication, I see little reason to upgrade myself or clients.
My clients do not want the added cost of SQL Server, (most are clients with 5 to 50 users and a shared data MDB on the server works just fine), and I make extensive use of user/group managed security to manage the applications.
As an Access programmer since v1.1,I am tired of MS constantly forcing radical change requiring TOTAL rewriting of applications, simply to produce incompatibility with previous versions and forcing users to upgrade. MS has been kicking the Access community like an old can.
90% of the "features" introduced in the past 3 "upgrades" are needed or used by a small percentage of users. Unless they make something that is currently near impossible, magicly manageable, there is little chance of me or my clients upgrading.
I have been considering upgrading an Access 97 project for some time, but it relies heavily on user level security to allow groups of users varying read and write access. With the possibilty of needing to completely re write these areas the attraction of Access diminishes!
William T
For the past 7 years, I have been developing Access applications. The bulk of my work concentrates on analysis/reporting applications, each of which requires user level security to control user access to the reports. I dread having to create a user level security class to carry these databases to the next version and beyond.
Most likely, I will be migrating all the databases to SQL Server and all the applications to a web server.
PS - So far, while using Beta 2, I have not been able to login to an existing database as any user other than Admin because I can't find the workgroup administrator utility. Any suggestions?
The missing user-level security in the new Access 2007 turns out to be a big issue for me as well. I have no way of joining a workgroup file I created, and thus when trying to open one of our databases, I just get an error message saying I don't have enough permissions.
It seems to me that Microsoft doesn't want people to get away with developing serious database systems with Access. They'd rather have you purchase a SQL Server license, I suppose... I'm rolling back to 2003.
FYI - There is at least one way to join a workgroup in Access 2007:
1. Press Ctrl-G to open the VBA editor.
2. In the Immediate pane, type: Application.SetDefaultWorkgroupFile "path" where path is the path and filename of the workgroup file you want to join.
The workgroup path for Access 2007 is stored in the following registry key:
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Office\12.0\Access\Access Connectivity Engine\Engines\SystemDB
Microsoft is clearly trying to force advanced developers into migrating to a SQL Server and ASP.NET solution. This objective is glaringly obvious under the light of the workgroup issue and the Fisher-Price interface presented in the ribbon bar.
I've been having a play with Beta 2 and it appears to me that security is just about dead in Access 2007. Even with the Navigation Pane set to restrict access to database objects, you can still get to all of them by opening another database and using GetObject to hook into your so-called secure database. For example, any linked table is easy to get at and alter the data. I have done it with a front end linked to an Access back end, but would think the same thing would be true for a front end linked to SQL Server (and Sharepoint?). So that means Access with linked tables has no security. Oh joy.
The only thing that comes to my mind to get round this is to use stored procedures for all data access (if you have SQL Server as your back end and more time on your hands than most people), make all your forms unbound (again, time consuming) or bind your forms to a DAO or ADO recordset built from inline SQL opening up a password-protected Access back end or server database. Don't bother storing queries in the front end as they are wide open too.
Being yet another developer since v1.1 I have applications that rely on workgroup security.
Why can't MS provide a simple method of locking users from the "guts" of the system? Stop users accessing tables directly for a start in an MDE, then we can control user access via code simply enough.
My users can not afford to implement MSSQL nor do I have the time to redevelop apps. (I'd love to, but it's not going to happen).
MS needs to support the many developers who develop for small/medium sized business for whom Access provided a very cost effective solution.
Sharepoint? Who cares?
So many people say that "Workgroup Security Didn't Work for me" .. well ... I contend that all those folks who say that, don't understand it. Security in general is not the most easy to grasp topic and at the first sign of mis-understanding, too many people make the claim that "it doesn't work!". I set up security on a SQL Server backend, and found it to be as complex ... if not MORE complex than MSAccess workgroup security! ... Since SQL Security is so complicated ... maybe MS should ditch it too ... or just set up one db password for all! ... lets just all trust that no one will tamper with our systems. It is rather disheartening to think that MS finds great joy in pushing us "forward" with respect to the UI ... but have no problems pushing us (MSAccess developers) backwards with respect to development capability!. For example: "improved Macros"! .. COME ON!! .. I spend A LOT of time trying to PREVENT the use of them!! ... macros will not win the hearts of many developers! Where's all the "improvements" for the VBA environment? ... oh yes .. there are none! ... It seems the writing is on the wall.. If you want to be a developer ... you can't do it with MSAccess! .. Especially if we can not protect our "stuff" ... all we will have is a glorified spreadsheet with a single password ... seems like fighting a grizzly bear with a butter knife.
alan cossey ...
Your quote:
>>> For example, any linked table is easy to get at and alter the data. I have done it with a front end linked to an Access back end, but would think the same thing would be true for a front end linked to SQL Server (and Sharepoint?). So that means Access with linked tables has no security. <<<
If you can open a new database, then import objects from a "secured" db ... then your security is set up incorrectly!!! I have been work group security to successfully protect my db's for quite some time ... and you can not do a Get External Data/Import or open my db's through code. All I use to protect my apps is workgroups ... Granted, their are tools out their that can "break-in" but in my mind MSAccess should then improve upon a system that protects, instead of just giving up on a system altogether ... Definately a sore spot that feeds into the viewpoint that you can not build a serious application with MSAccess ... I guess the latest "upgrade" finally supports that view.
>>> or open my db's through code. <<
Should be:
or open my db's through EXTERNAL code in an attempt to bypass security!
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